A Clean Deluxe, and a Dumble lead preset.

Discussion in 'Preset Exchange' started by Clint Martin, Dec 8, 2019.

  1. Clint Martin

    Clint Martin Senior Member

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    These were made with my Amplifire 12 so the presets are setup with EXP "A" for WAH, and "B" for volume.
    They both have all of the effects on that I typically use. If the effect isn't on, it may not be tweaked at all.
    They are volume balanced so that the level on the unit itself should be at 100% without the fear of clipping.
    I'm sharing these to help someone new see the workflow that I typically use.
    I use these as a reference, and a template for any new presets I may make. Just switch out the amp and cab, balance the volume of the new amp with these and you have a new preset with the same effects.
    Let me know what you think, or how your workflow is different to mine.
    ...and feel free to comment on the sounds.
     

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  2. slateboy

    slateboy Senior Member

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    Kind of you to share these, @Clint Martin
    What cab IRs do these use?
     
  3. Clint Martin

    Clint Martin Senior Member

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    The Deluxe uses a Celestion A-type 112 openback, and the Dumble is a Celestion A-type 4x12, but I often change the IRs.
     
  4. DreamTheaterRules

    DreamTheaterRules Well-Known Member

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    @Clint Martin it's too bad we can't give away some of the new clean presets we're making with JM's C IR. As soon as you turn it up a bit those are clearly my best ones ever. I guess as long as we know Jay gave someone the IR, we could exchange presets. So you and I and Nelson and whomever else we know got it from Jay, we could trade presets, but not list them publicly.
     
  5. Eric Raymond

    Eric Raymond Well-Known Member

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    You can change the cab and export the preset with the instructions to add the JM C IR if you have it.
     
  6. slateboy

    slateboy Senior Member

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    @DreamTheaterRules Are you able to share some audio-demos of this stuff? Would be nice to hear how others are using this cab IR.
    Personally, i didn't find it/them useful but appreciate tastes and opinions are personal and subjective. It appears to have some good reviews.
    Has anyone been able to say what the "x-factor" is that makes these IRs appealing?
    Would love to hear any sounds you have.
    thanks
     
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  7. Jay Mitchell

    Jay Mitchell Active Member

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    I find that interesting, given that I did not share them with you. How did you come by them?
     
  8. DreamTheaterRules

    DreamTheaterRules Well-Known Member

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    I'm no scientist, (although I play one in a small community theater group) but I'd say the "X factor" is just what Jay said it was. I did multiple tests to make sure I wasn't experiencing confirmation bias. The proof for me, that it is JUST what Jay said it is, is that I could actually get MORE good bass out of my presets with his C IR than I could with any other IR I tried. I'll try not to write a book, but here is what I mean by that.

    Yes, it has FAR less bass than any other preset I tried. I immediately removed the "pre" bass cut that seems to be on every other preset using every other IR I own. (Note: Why is that? ;)). It still has less bass. Now, turn the knobs on the amp. I know, novel concept, right? I have presets I previously enjoyed for a couple years. Even with the bass cut in "pre", I still had the bass knob at 3 on the amp. When I turned the amp up, that's all it could handle or my FRFR (and the other better ones that I tried) started to sound tubby, bloated, boomy, whatever you want to call it, if I turned the bass any higher.

    Fast forward to the IR C. Remove "pre", turn bass on the amp up to 5. Immediately notice that you have a much cleaner, tighter bass. Up to 6, now the preset is BIG. Lots of bottom end. The difference though, is that with the same FRFR, it's tight, defined, NOT boomy and tubby sounding. Now, since it is obviously more transparent, lets see how far we can go with this... Bass knob up to 8 is more bottom end than I've ever been able to get out of that preset , yet it is still not ill defined, boomy, or "inaccurate." It's tight, punchy and CLEAR. And, it's all that with more overall bass output than I've ever been able to stand with this preset. There are no rolloff filters anywhere. The FRFR's that I tried and thought needed to be upgraded now sound better than they ever have. The plastic cases and 8" woofers in the first one I tried, now put out better bass than I've ever heard them put out. The "boomy" loss of definition in the bass, that I had previously blamed on the FRFRs, was now clear, tight and punchy... so the FRFRs are better than I thought! Same with the 10's and 12s I tried later.

    And, I hear a similar clarity and transparency in the mids and the high end. No sizzle or crunchiness in the high end. Even with a lot of treble, it's a lot but still smooth.

    Said this before. The irony of my favorite IR being of a speaker that wouldn't even be on my list of real speakers to try, shows you that something else is going on that trumps even the speaker choice. The difference is even clear on the cheapest "monitors" I tried them on (M Audio BX8s). FRFRs were QSC- CP8, K10.2, K12, and I got a couple seconds on DXR10s.

    IF I find the same magic in one of Jay's 4x12 cabs (I have two versions), I'll probably immediately be taking a bit more serious plunge on modeling, and shopping for a pair of RCF 10s or 12s. But the clean and cleanish presets are "next level" already, with the C IR.
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2019
  9. slateboy

    slateboy Senior Member

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    There was a link where someone else had shared them On the gearpage site, a few months back, though i dont visit that site that often. Unless, of course, i was misdirected to some fake or incorrect files?
     

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    Last edited: Dec 16, 2019
  10. Clint Martin

    Clint Martin Senior Member

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    I will not share Jay's IRs without his written permission to do so. I gave him my word, and that is that.
    ...but for those that have it, it's cool to be able to test and compare commercial IRs with something that actually sounds like the cab.
    I believe the presets I posted here sounds pretty good (for my taste), but you'll notice the things I had to do to get it there.
    Jay's Irs require nothing more than the knobs on the amp. No high pass or low pass, or any other eq at all.
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2019
  11. Clint Martin

    Clint Martin Senior Member

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    @slateboy @Jay Mitchell @DreamTheaterRules
    I'll try to make some sound clips that should show the difference Jay's IR makes, but the main difference is in the amount of hoops one has to jump through to get my modeler to sound like an actual amp. Which requires different settings. Those things can't be heard. Let me think about how to do it.
     
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  12. Jay Mitchell

    Jay Mitchell Active Member

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    The IRs of mine linked in that post are not the IRs being referenced in this thread.
     
  13. slateboy

    slateboy Senior Member

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    Ah, that explains it then
    More curious now to discover more about these legendary IRs .
    Are you still sharing them, @Jay Mitchell ?
     
  14. NelsonP

    NelsonP Senior Member

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    I'm up for sharing presets, with the caveat that I run some pedals with my Amplifire (EP Boost, EQD Plumes and EHX Green Russian Big Muff) before the input and a Reverb pedal in the loop. But I can set up some using just the internal effects in Amplifire which get you 90% of the way there.

    I think we could probably get to a very nice clean preset between us!
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2019
  15. DreamTheaterRules

    DreamTheaterRules Well-Known Member

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    I agree with what you said about how easy it is to get there, but think there is more too it than that. My acid test was going for those big piano notes with the neck pickups of A) my Tokai strat with vintage wind pickups, B) my EBMM Cutlass, C) my PRS NF3 and 4) the tapped position of my 57/08 in my 25th Ann. Custom 22 Semi Hollow LTD. These big "piano tone" notes were bigger than I've ever heard them for a modeler and way more realistic sounding than before, and I'd attribute that to increased clarity and definition from the bottom up through the mids. Again, no boom or mud.

    The lack of definition that I was previously blaming on my FRFR was really being caused by the IRs. Jay made a few direct replies to me at TGP about some questions I had. In one, he mentioned how many para EQ cuts you'd need on a regular IR to remove the reflections. And, then you'd be removing "real" content in that frequency range as well. I've lost the number, but it was a lot! About double what I would have guessed. The terms to describe this are "iffy" at best, and I don't want to go all audiophile on you (I'm trying to recover from that phase. LOL) but IMHO, reflections don't add just more "volume" at a particular frequecy range, they time smear that range and create mud/lack of focus or definition or whatever you want to call it. When we add all our bottom and top filters just to tame the normal IRs, we're removing some of the good with the bad. When we tame it down to a "level" that sounds right, we still have a mix of good and bad... source and reflections. SO we've only removed boom by reducing level, not by getting rid of the problem. Remove the reflections, and you have clear, tight bass that is so much more well defined, you can turn your bass up higher than ever before because it doesn't get overwhelmingly boomy, tubby, ill defined, etc., because you aren't turning up all the bad stuff that's in most IRS, just the notes themselves as they should be represented. It just sounds more like a guitar speaker!

    So I don't think it's just easier to get there with the C IR, I think "there" is a higher level tone than before. And that is a HUGE win. Instead of fighting highs and lows to get there, you turn it on, dial the amp knobs (only, just like a real amp) and end up with better tone! What more could you want? The answer of course, is, MORE RF FF IRs! :)
     
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